verticale

English translation: height of the street-facing vertical wall (or vertical facade)

16:19 Feb 14, 2021
French to English translations [PRO]
Law/Patents - Construction / Civil Engineering
French term or phrase: verticale
Document about planning law.

"Il y a lieu de constater que, selon la jurisprudence, il y a « construction nouvelle édifiée sans permis » lorsque les transformations opérées irrégulièrement « aboutissent à réaliser une construction n’ayant plus aucun lien avec la précédente » ou bien lorsqu’ils constituent « une construction nouvelle différant par sa conception, son importance et son aspect extérieur de l’ancien bâtiment, alors même que la hauteur de leur verticale et leur surface hors œuvre nette sont presque similaires »."

In my naivety I assume this means "their heights". But why not just say leurs hauteurs... ?

NB Termium suggests "plumb line" and GDT suggests "stanchion" or "lattice stanchion". These latter appear to refer specifically to windows.
Mpoma
United Kingdom
Local time: 20:02
English translation:height of the street-facing vertical wall (or vertical facade)
Explanation:
I believe it's the height of the vertical wall (or vertical facade) that faces onto the street. There are a myriad of regulations that determine how high this should be depending on the width of the street, overhangs, projecting structures etc.. Also how high it should be if there are two sides of the building that face different streets when the streets are at different levels. (The total height of the building is called the 'hauteur plafond'.) See https://dtlab.fr/2004/10/31/essai-sur-lilot-si-paris-metait-... and https://www.apur.org/sites/default/files/documents/incidence... for plenty of diagrams.
Selected response from:

Althea Draper
United Kingdom
Grading comment
Thanks
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer



Summary of answers provided
3 +1height of the street-facing vertical wall (or vertical facade)
Althea Draper
3upright direction
Lisa Rosengard
2height in terms of elevation
Conor McAuley
Summary of reference entries provided
One ghit but does it help?
SafeTex

Discussion entries: 4





  

Answers


16 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 2/5Answerer confidence 2/5
height in terms of elevation


Explanation:

I would be fascinated to hear if there is a technical explanation, but I think this is just a stylistic effect -- the author could have just said "height", is my gut feeling.

"Elevation" conjures up building plans (architects talk about side elevations, front elevations, etc.) and also distance from the ground.

https://www.homify.in/ideabooks/6942724/exceptional-front-el...

Also, I think it should be singular: "une construction...". I don't know why "leur" is in there.

Conor McAuley
France
Local time: 21:02
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 50

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  SafeTex: Yes, I had just come back to say this. if the building is on a slope, it doesn't slope also but has the same elevation (one side is lower than the other to achieve this)
4 mins
  -> Thanks SafeTex!

neutral  philgoddard: This doesn't convey any clear meaning to me. Also, if you're saying the French is a tautology, which I think it probably is, you shouldn't reproduce it in the English.
1 hr
  -> Yes, there is only one ghit for the French term (see SafeTex's reference) => it's not a technical term at all -- translate as "height" OR as "elevation". "Leur" refers to (the old) "construction" and to (the new) "bâtiment".

disagree  Daryo: "leur" is not there by some kind of mistake, or just for padding the text, same as "could have just said "height"" is wrong. // I don't understand the text but still will translate it is some new method?
11 hrs
  -> I did not say that "leur" = stylistic. It ("leur") refers to "construction" and "bâtiment". Finally, confidence level 2 is some new method of saying not confident and I later withdrew my answer (in reply to Phil), despite support (SafeTex and Dominique).
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2 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 peer agreement (net): +1
la hauteur de la verticale
height of the street-facing vertical wall (or vertical facade)


Explanation:
I believe it's the height of the vertical wall (or vertical facade) that faces onto the street. There are a myriad of regulations that determine how high this should be depending on the width of the street, overhangs, projecting structures etc.. Also how high it should be if there are two sides of the building that face different streets when the streets are at different levels. (The total height of the building is called the 'hauteur plafond'.) See https://dtlab.fr/2004/10/31/essai-sur-lilot-si-paris-metait-... and https://www.apur.org/sites/default/files/documents/incidence... for plenty of diagrams.


    Reference: http://www.apur.org/sites/default/files/documents/incidences...
    Reference: http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C3%89pannelage_(architecture)
Althea Draper
United Kingdom
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 51
Grading comment
Thanks
Notes to answerer
Asker: Aha, astute, thanks.


Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Daryo: the height of the street-facing vertical wall (or vertical facade) of the new construction compared to the height of the street-facing vertical wall (or vertical facade) of the previous construction.
9 hrs
  -> Thanks Daryo
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23 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5
upright direction


Explanation:
'It's a reference to a newly built-up (edified) construction without a permit. Operated modifications and transformations took place irregularly, resulting in the completion of a construction with no previous occurrence or precedent. It constitutes a new construction unlike the initial concept of its design. The old building's importance and exterior appearance, even their vertical (upright directional) height and their surface outside of the clearly defined opening are fairly similar.'

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Note added at 23 hrs (2021-02-15 15:34:47 GMT)
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'il constitue une construction nouvelle à différence du concept initial de son dessein. L'importance du bâtiment vieil et l'aspect de son extérieur, même l'hauteur de leur verticale (l'orientation vers le haut) et la taille de leurs surfaces, hors de l'ouverture clairement définie sont assez pareils.'

Example sentence(s):
  • 'Il s'agit d'une construction récemment édifiée sans permis. Des modifications et des transformations ont eu lieu irrégulièrement, avec la réalisation d'une construction comme résultat sans aucune précédence (ni une occurrence antérieure).
  • Il constitue une construction nouvelle à différence du concept initial de son dessein. L'importance du bâtiment vieil et l'aspect de son extérieure, même l'hauteur de leur verticale (l'orientation vers le haut) et la taille de leurs surfaces, hors d
Lisa Rosengard
United Kingdom
Local time: 20:02
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 15
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Reference comments


8 mins peer agreement (net): +2
Reference: One ghit but does it help?

Reference information:
Maybe this one hit can help someone to solve this question?


    https://50ans.apur.org/fr/home/1967-1977/traitement-differencie-des-tissus-urbains-des-arrondissements-peripheriques-1309.html
SafeTex
France
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 39
Note to reference poster
Asker: Very nice... so it appears to be about "zoning" and aesthetics. I.e. to stop Haussmann's baby degenrating into an anti-Cartesian mishmash like London.


Peer comments on this reference comment (and responses from the reference poster)
agree  philgoddard
2 hrs
  -> Thanks Philgoddard
agree  Conor McAuley
16 hrs
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