Glossary entry

Spanish term or phrase:

Indisciplina o desobediencia en el trabajo

English translation:

misconduct and failure to comply with the rules

Added to glossary by Ruth Ramsey
Aug 9, 2018 20:16
5 yrs ago
6 viewers *
Spanish term

Indisciplina o desobediencia en el trabajo

Spanish to English Bus/Financial Finance (general) Employment Contract
Employment Contract (Spain)

Would this be "insubordination or non-compliance on the job/at work"? I'm wondering if there's a better term than "non-compliance" for "desobediencia"

Thanks very much in advance.

"Será considerardas faltas muy graves las siguientes:

Ausencia del trabajador sin justificar por más de tres días.
Indisciplina o desobediencia en el trabajo"
Votes to reclassify question as PRO/non-PRO:

Non-PRO (1): philgoddard

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Discussion

Ruth Ramsey (asker) Aug 20, 2018:
Thanks for following up on this, Domini.
Domini Lucas Aug 17, 2018:
@David Hollywood @Ruth I promised to post these links when at the PC. I know the question is now closed, but I am posting them for the sake of completion (and because I promised!). Also in case they are useful in future.

Note "serious insubordination" as included as a form of gross misconduct on p.32 of this link: http://www.acas.org.uk/media/pdf/9/g/Discipline-and-grievanc...

Also, end of first paragraph of section 2 of this document: https://www.lawdonut.co.uk/business/employment-law/disciplin...

As mentioned previously, I can only find serious /gross insubordination as a 'sub-section' and, unless an employee is wholly unsuitable (and probably shouldn't have been hired in the first place!), it should take quite a bit of doing to get to this point!
Domini Lucas Aug 16, 2018:
@Ruth That’s very kind of you. Glad it was helpful. :-)
Domini Lucas Aug 15, 2018:
@David Hollywood @Asker This has been tickling my brain since posting the neutral comment to your reference entry and I have done some more digging. I find I am wrong and gross insubordination can be a cause of disciplinary etc in the UK as well (though the employment contracts I was involved in have never included it and, when talking to another manager, they said they had the same experience as me). I still think desobedencia may be more general here, however I feel I must apologise for originally saying insubordination doesn’t apply as a cause for disciplinary in the UK. I tried to delete my neutral comment completely but the system wouldn’t let me. Hence this note. I can’t post the link I found just now (on Ipad), but will do when I get a chance for sake of completeness.
Domini Lucas Aug 11, 2018:
@polyglot That's kind. Have done and credited you as well to the extent that it's possible. :-)
polyglot45 Aug 11, 2018:
@Domini feel free to post yourself
Domini Lucas Aug 10, 2018:
@polyglot I was about to post "misconduct and failure to comply with regulations" and saw your comment. If you post it as an answer I will agree with you. I think "regulations" rather than "rules" in a work context but I'll leave that choice up to you. Just had a discussion with another manager who says the same. My comments always presuppose a UK context.
Domini Lucas Aug 10, 2018:
financial discipline Unless... there is a link with 'financial discipline'? It doesn't sound like it, but you did classify the question as 'financial' as well as business, hence the mention.

Domini Lucas Aug 10, 2018:
hr context Having written numerous staff and volunteer contracts (as a manager) in conjunction with HR professionals, I haven’t ever used disobedience or indiscipline in a work context. Also, unless there is an explicit reason (in the wider context) to include ‘discipline’ or ‘indiscipline’ I would be reticent to use them in this kind of list form because there could be a ‘confusion’ with a Disciplinary/ ‘need to discipline’ a member of staff leading to a Disciplinary. Usually this would be included in a company’s/department’s Disciplinary Policy, however there could be mention of the verb discipline with this meaning in an employment contract as well. I'm referring to the UK. I don't know about the US.
polyglot45 Aug 10, 2018:
I suspect that we would say something like failure to obey orders or to (conform to) comply with the rules - I suppose they mean such things as timekeeping by that.

For me "failure to" is the key
Joshua Parker Aug 9, 2018:
For what it's worth, I also prefer "non-compliance" or "insubordination" to "disobedience" in this context.
David Hollywood Aug 9, 2018:
not only used in a military context but has a specific meaning in HR matters so let's see what others have to say
David Hollywood Aug 9, 2018:
maybe "insubordination" rather than "disobedience"
Ruth Ramsey (asker) Aug 9, 2018:
I'm not sure about using "disobedience". It sounds as though it's referring to a child rather than an employee.

Proposed translations

1 day 20 hrs
Selected

misconduct and failure to comply with regulations

As per my discussion entry above. Including @polyglot's comments.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 1 day 20 hrs (2018-08-11 16:37:35 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

I agree with @polyglot that 'failure to' is important. In my case I opt for 'failure to comply' as more suitable to the context.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 5 days (2018-08-15 12:33:44 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

I also agree with @polyglot that it could refer to failure to follow direct instructions, so asker’s context may determine whether ‘regulations’, ‘instructions’ or something else is more suitable. I appreciate that this is the problem with using ‘failure to comply’ rather than a noun. However, I still think it relevant.
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4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer. Comment: "I like this suggestion as it sounds more idiomatic. Thanks very much, Domini."
+3
3 mins

indiscipline or disobedience in the work place

my take
Peer comment(s):

agree David Hollywood : fine and will withdraw mine as almost identical and bearing in mind that we may get an alternative for disobedience
18 mins
Thanks!
agree AllegroTrans : right answer, poor explanation
35 mins
THanks!//Not that much to elaborate upon!
agree philgoddard : Workplace, one word.
36 mins
Thanks!
neutral Domini Lucas : not disobedience for reasons in discussion entry. I also don't think we use 'indiscipline' in HR in the UK.
1 day 1 hr
Something went wrong...
-1
3 hrs

Indiscipline or defiance at workplace

I would take "defiance" instead non-compliance, since this term conveys the idea of indiscipline but, unlike the terms "disobedience/non-compliance" (which you do not want to choose), there is no "infantile" charge on it, conveying an idea of a more "professional/adult" disobedience than "informal/infantile" disobedience (pirouette).
Example sentence:

We will not tolerate any defiance at workplace.

Peer comment(s):

disagree Domini Lucas : Apologies for the disagree, but to me defiance also conveys an infantile or at least "teenage" attitude. Plus it wouldn´t work in a UK work context.
1 day 50 mins
Something went wrong...
14 hrs

lack of discipline and insubordination

My take.

I think the indisciplina is probably referring to work ethic.
Something went wrong...
+3
5 hrs

insubordination or misconduct

Two of the top 10 reason that employees are fired.

https://www.thebalancecareers.com/top-reasons-for-getting-fi...



--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 1 day 2 hrs (2018-08-10 22:22:55 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

sorry - should have used 'and', not 'or'
Peer comment(s):

agree David Hollywood : agree
1 hr
thanks, David
agree Jean Shearer
11 hrs
thanks , Jean
agree neilmac : I prefer this option...
13 hrs
thanks, neilmac
neutral Domini Lucas : I agree with misconduct. I don't think it is insubordination in this context.
20 hrs
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Reference comments

27 mins
Reference:

insubordination

One of the issues that is almost always present in the workplace, regardless of the culture of camaraderie, ethics, and teamwork being cultivated, is insubordination. There is always one or two employees with bad attitudes and who refuse to work for the job that they signed up in. It’s just too bad that the recruitment officer did not see the disruptive behavior behind an employee’s smiling and friendly façade before they were hired. But now that they are part of the organization, kicking them out would not be as easy.

Insubordinate behavior, however, is grounds for termination. But before any action is taken against a problematic employee, it is vital that he is aware about company policies pertaining to insubordination, or that HR officers made it perfectly clear what constitutes insubordination in the company handbook or during employee orientation. The lack thereof can lead to confusion, and might even give an insubordinate employee the upper hand.

What Exactly Is Insubordination In The Workplace?
If it was anywhere else but in the office, insubordination can refer to someone who is disrespectful or disobedient. But its definition is more specific in a corporate setting, and should not be confused with insolence. Insubordination at work is when an employee refuses to obey a direct order from a supervisor. In a legal aspect, it can also mean willful or intentional disobedience of a lawful and reasonable request by a supervisor. It may also refer to disrespect or harassment that is directed toward a superior.

The California Supreme Court defined it as “a refusal to obey some order which a superior officer is entitled to give and entitled to have obeyed”, which has been expanded by the Employment Development Department of California to cover other situations — “(1) disobeying an employer’s order or instruction, (2) disputing or ridiculing authority, (3) exceeding authority or (4) using vulgar or profane language towards a supervisor”.

Although the gist of the definition is almost the same, insubordination can take many forms. Apart from refusal to carry out work, it also constitutes non-performance, inappropriate comments, confrontation, inappropriate language, and even non-verbal expression of dissatisfaction, such as eye rolling as a gesture of disrespect. Considering these situations, it is important that HR officers clearly define what constitutes insubordination in the workplace.
Peer comments on this reference comment:

agree Taña Dalglish : Definitely prefer insubordination to disobedience. https://www.thesaurus.com/browse/insubordination / https://www.thesaurus.com/browse/disobedience (misbehaviour/misconduct, maybe other options?)
5 hrs
neutral Domini Lucas : I think 'insubordination' is specific' I think the Spanish may be more general.
1 day 1 hr
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