Edward Plaisance Jr Jul 4, 2011:

Just out of curiosity...can you check the translated book and see whether Freud used noumen in the text or whether maybe the translator uses it in his introduction?

Shaily Zolfagari Jul 4, 2011:

Okay! I have the translated book though! But i'll bow to ur wisdom anyway!

Edward Plaisance Jr Jul 4, 2011:

more food for thought... I did see نومن in earlier searching and I just finished Googling نومن itself. It seems that all the instances are referring to "noumenon" (See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Noumenon) and NOT the usage here "noumen", which the author says is NOT the Kantian usage. However, both words are derived from Greek.

In both cases the word was "invented" by a writer/thinker who proceeds to explain what it means in his world.

Freud's book "The Psychopathology of Everyday Life" is where he presents "Freudian slips" and "noumen/noumenon" does not occur in the English translation I just checked.

Shaily Zolfagari Jul 3, 2011:

But sweetheart many medical terms, psychology specifically, rely on the original english or in your case french stem word. I believe that the science of psychology refers to noumen as noumen or NOMAN in farsi as well. I can only suggest one book off the top of my head that has reference to this and its "eshtebahate loppi" by one and only Ziggy Frued translated by hossein aroumandi!

Edward Plaisance Jr Jul 3, 2011:

(part 3) ...have you seen my suggested translation below? It is the last one in the list so far...you might prefer مشترک in place or جمعی ...I hope the readers are familiar with this even before they start reading...otherwise, no matter how much you try to explain it, they will be lost...I got tired of reading it after the first few sentences.

Tahmineh Zardasht (asker) Jul 3, 2011:

Dear Edward,
Many thanks for your clarification. But Ido need an equivalent. I cannot mention English word in Translated file.

Edward Plaisance Jr Jul 3, 2011:

(part 2) At first I was confused by the use of "noumen" rather than "noumenon" which is found in Kantian philosophy, and which is defined in some of the suggested translations here.

When I found the article below, it became clear this is a different term. It is actually well explained in the text: noumen is not only a normative collective mind....

So, we can say: noumen=normative collective mind

Edward Plaisance Jr Jul 3, 2011:

noumen vs. noumenon (part 1)
This is from the text you are working on:

"From this by the term “group psychology” can mean the psychology of a structured collection of individuals among which has arisen a normative mind, seated in the noumen, and operates in a way that may be distinct from that of the individuals that make it up. The noumen used here is not that absolute mental region of Being described by Kant, but rather a more relative one that exists alongside visions, images, ideas and patterns of thinking. The normative nature often coincides with fuzzy processes due to the inability of people to adequately understand each other, due ultimately to the principle of knowledge migration (Yolles, 2006). More or less coherent social collectives like countries and enterprises are durable social collectives that develop behaviour by virtue of the noumenal and existential that they have. The noumen is not only a normative collective mind, but it is also capable of associative projection (after Piaget) that allows the coordination of perspectives from others in its social environment, and this can influence its behaviour.